Patch Poll: Is Violent Weather Linked to Global Warming?
We are enjoying great warm weather, but tornado season has started.
What a wonderful weekend it was, weather-wise. Temperatures were in the 80s, and it is not yet spring. What kind of weather is in store? Apparently warm weather and tornadoes.
AccuWeather.com reports an active severe weather season is anticipated in the U.S. for spring with the most widespread warmth since 2004.
"As far as the forecast for the spring of 2012, we do feel like it's going to be a mild spring for most of the nation from the eastern Rockies into the Ohio Valley and Great Lakes area," Paul Pastelok, expert long-range meteorologist and leader of the AccuWeather.com Long-Range Forecasting Team, said. "At least two-thirds of the nation could wind up with above-normal temperatures."
An above-normal number of tornadoes are forecast for this season with water temperatures in the Gulf of Mexico running above normal for this time of year. The active severe weather season follows a deadly year with a near-record number of tornadoes in 2011.
Typically, 1,300 tornadoes strike the U.S. a year. There were nearly 1,700 tornadoes in 2011, falling short of the record 1,817 tornadoes set in 2004. Illinois already suffered a devastating tornado March 1 in Harrisburg.
"Areas that seemed to miss out on frequent severe weather last year may see an uptick this year," AccuWeather.com Expert Senior Meteorologist Dan Kottlowski said.
January was an unusually violent month for tornadoes in the country: 70 twisters have been reported. And more could be on the way.
This January is the third-highest in January since accurate tornado records began in 1950, Greg Carbin, warning coordination meteorologist with the Storm Prediction Center in Norman, OK, told USAToday. Since 1950, only January 1999 (with 212) and January 2008 (with 84) saw more tornadoes.
The pattern that led to the stormy January is forecast to continue, which could cause another savage storm season this spring. The climate pattern, called La Niña, tends to produce large tornado outbreaks from January to April across the USA. La Niña refers to cooler-than-average tropical Pacific Ocean water that affects weather and climate around the world. La Niña is forecast to continue into the spring, according to the Climate Prediction Center.
"The spring [temperatures] will start out well above normal through the Great Lakes but may head into a back-and-forth pattern for April and early May, more of a typical spring," Pastelok said. "Snow chances will be limited through March with a small chance for a couple of events in April."
Overall, despite some cool periods and chances of snow, most of the Great Lakes will end up with above-normal temperatures this spring. Chicago and Milwaukee will have above-normal temperatures and near-normal precipitation.
Mike Bruno
8:34 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
From a scientific perspective, the poll is a bit ill-stated. Climate change can only be implicated in long-term trends in weather patterns. Individual storms (or even seasons) vary wildly, so we can't properly blame climate change on our recent local weather. That said; the *overwhelming scientific consensus* is that the long term trend is a warming planet influence by human activity. We may have had a freakishly warm season past, but climate change would have made it incrementally more extreme.
Independence666
10:59 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
"Consensus" does not make something true, no matter who is in agreement. At one time, there was consensus that the earth was flat and that It was the center of the universe. If "climate change" (aka globalwarming) is really happening at all, we'd better have iron clad proof that it is being caused by humans before we pass any more crazy laws that retard progress.
Ben
11:19 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
It's not quite true that "climate change can only be implicated in long-term trends in weather patterns." What is true is that all weather patterns are now being impacted by global climate change. No weather system is unaffected by it. What can't be said precisely is *how much* effect is due to global climate change.
Billy Gallagher
8:55 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Who remembers the TIME Magazine cover story from 1975: "The coming Ice Age"?
Not that long ago, the 'scientific evidence' was for global climate change, but in the opposite direction that this 'story' suggests. Do we always need a worry to distract us from the real problems facing us? Anyway, here is the lead from that article:
In Africa, drought continues for the sixth consecutive year, adding terribly to the toll of famine victims. During 1972 record rains in parts of the U.S., Pakistan and Japan caused some of the worst flooding in centuries. In Canada's wheat belt, a particularly chilly and rainy spring has delayed planting and may well bring a disappointingly small harvest. Rainy Britain, on the other hand, has suffered from uncharacteristic dry spells the past few springs. A series of unusually cold winters has gripped the American Far West, while New England and northern Europe have...
Mike Bruno
9:07 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Well our science and ability to uncover and measure data and historical atmospheric conditions has come a long way since 1975. 1975 would be considered practically medieval by today's standards.
Virtually every natural scientist now recognizes human-exacerbated climate change as...for all intents and purposes...fact. We should recognize that climate change is confirmed by climate measurements in the world as a whole. That there are cold spots and warm spots and dry spots and wet spots does not refute climate change...though the consensus is that there will be more extremes with a trend toward warmer.
Paul
6:26 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
That was Time magazine, blowing up a story of basically a couple fringe scientists. At the time, the climate change organizations stated that the chances were that global warming was more realistic based upon greenhouse gas emissions. Thirty five years later, this is a documented scientific reality, with hardly any real dissent. Yet guys like you still point to a 1975 article in a magazine, when journals like Nature and Science have published reams of info on global warming since then.
jimspice
8:25 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
There was never widely accepted "scientific evidence" for global cooling. Go do a bit of reading outside your comfort zone and you may realize your sources have been lying to you.
Rick Nagel
9:17 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
It's long out of date, but the late Michael Crichton's concluding essay in "State of Fear" (and the premise of the novel) offers an interesting perspective. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_of_Fear
Mike Bruno
9:32 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Reading the Wiki entry does bring up some separate questions. Even if we accept scientific consensus on climate change, that doesn't mean that the question of what to do about it is clear. The data would indicate that we could be in the very last moments of actually being able to mitigate human influence, but it would take 100% cooperation by everyone everywhere in the [industrialized] world. ....like that's gonna happen! In the worst case scenario, massive sea-life die-offs and crop failures could cull world population pretty effectively. Problem solved!! :-)
Not being a climate scientist myself (though I am a scientist), I will favor the National Academy of Sciences over Michael Chrichton for insights on the matter.
MattG
10:03 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
A poll to determine scientific research? Really, are you kidding?
Maybe we could have a poll on whether or not the earth is flat.
Maybe a poll could determine what the right number for PI is (actually, there is some controversy there).
A poll might finally solve the riddle of whether or not Einstein's Theory of Relativity is wrong and we could save billions in research at CERN, since that is one of the subjects of discussion.
Either global warming is causing radical weather or it's not. That's a matter of scientific research. What I or anyone else might think is irrelevant. Sorry, these polls are really pretty dumb.
Mike Bruno
10:13 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Good point Matt. Though I think there is some value (for me at least) in assessing the level of acceptance of scientific consensus by the population. Non-scientists, though, will probably see the results as validation of their skepticism.
MattG
10:58 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Agreed, Mike. There is a very valid point of the public perception of scientific debate. However, I think we all need to realize that polls like this represent the public's perception of the "marketing" effort of scientific research, not the validity of the research. The old axiom is that those that have the weakest scientific justification tend to talk the most. Thoughtful, careful researchers rarely venture out into the public domain to extole their research until it has been carefully vetted. Those with weak arguments and those that have not gone through thoughtful peer review tend to blab a lot.
Sundance
10:42 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Mike Bruno - How do you reconcile Ben Santer's comments, in his latest paper, on 17 years little to no Trpospheric warming and the RSS data showing no warming in the last 17 years?
What about the American Meteorological Society's 2008 'State Of The climate' report which included work by MET Office scientists showing that IPCC models were already falsified at the 90% level and that little to no warming for 5 more years would falsify the models at the 95% level? See page S21 here.
http://www1.ncdc.noaa.gov/pub/data/cmb/bams-sotc/climate-assessment-2008-lo-rez.pdf
I have family that design climate models and work with climate models and after talking to them I'm not convinced they have the feedbacks correct. I have several parameters of falsification I am tracking, have you established any so that you can track and measure results in a scientific manner?
Mike Bruno
11:40 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
As I have said elsewhere: The lay-person really only has one credible position on matters where they are not experts...and that is to turn to those that ARE experts. Even with the occasional contradictory study, the overwhelming majority of climate scientists speak with one voice. If I had to place my bets, I would go with the 5,000 in agreement vs the 100 that have differing opinions.
To think that the many thousands of unaffiliated scientists could engage in a coordinated effort to support climate change would be a conspiracy of unimaginable scale. And a conspiracy's success is *inversely and exponentially" correlated to the number of people involved. The real notoriety and money would go to the scientists that overturned that consensus.
Uncle Buckeye
11:07 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Just how many lies about the "acceptance of scientific consensus " of global warming must be uncovered before people realize it is nothing but fraud and deception!
Mike Bruno-9:07 am March 19
“Virtually every natural scientist now recognizes human-exacerbated climate change as...for all intents and purposes...fact.”
Scientific FACT:
1. Something that has been objectively verified.
2. Something having real, demonstrable existence
Theoretical thought neither equals objective verification nor is it demonstrable.
”We should recognize that climate change is confirmed by climate measurements in the world as a whole.”
Definition of climate change: “Climate change as referred to in the observational record of climate occurs because of internal changes within the climate system or in the interaction between its components, or because of changes in external forcing either for natural reasons or because of human activities. It is generally not possible clearly to make attribution between these causes.”
We all recognize we must be good stewards to the planet but common sense should not be excluded.
Well this big lie has netted algore a LOT of money now so maybe he’ll move on to something else.
Mike Bruno
11:27 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
Yeah. All those thousands of anonymous climate scientists are just ROLLING in money! :-)
Well, "facts" don't really exist outside of mathematics...hence my use of "for all intents and purposes". Gravity is a theory, heliocentrism is a theory, evolution is a theory. Do you not believe in any of those?
If one is not a bona-fide expert in the field, then one should have the humilty of turn to experts in those fields. I presume you would rather a heard surgeon perform your heart surgery instead of your auto mechanic. The lay person really only has one credible option in these matters...and that is to turn to the experts. The vast majority of climate scientists believe in human-exacerbated climate change. The REAL notoriety and money would be for the scientist that OVERTURNED the current consensus.
Nick Swedberg
11:39 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
@Mike Bruno—As a writer, I've often wondered if the climate change debate would be radically different if more people had a better understanding of what the words "hypothesis," "theory," "proof" and "fact" meant in the context of science and math.
Mike Bruno
11:46 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
@Nick
I am sure that would help inform a lot of people's understanding. I think we should ingrain the scientific method in primary school so our kids have a sense of what is evidence, anecdote, peer-review and the like. Too often we prefer our preconceptions and ideologies over genuine truth and evidence.
Lois Lane
11:56 am on Monday, March 19, 2012
After reading all of these comments I am exhausted! I think I'll keep it simple and give Tom Skilling a call.
Doremus Jessup
12:12 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Mr. Mike Bruno,
Nice to see you around these parts. I applaud your effort but your time might be easier spent trying to explain the color blue to the blind. This here patch is frequented by a sound bite breed indoctrinated by the likes of Limbaugh and Hannity who are unable or unwilling to understand the science because you can't explain it in 30 seconds. Here in Elmhurst we are faced with huge expenses because we have seen the reality of a 1 in 500 hundred year storm and a 1 in 100 hundred year storm very close together, I suspect after climate change has cost the local right wing climate change deniers they may come around because that is one thing they seem to believe in. As for me I'll do my part for our planet and won't shirk from having a conversation with climate deniers because I'd like to see our species thrive.
Independence666
2:09 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Interesting........aren't you also "frequenting this here patch".
Lois Lane
12:34 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Say what, Doremus?! Exactly what is "this here patch" and what/who is/are "climate deniers"?
Jim McMahon
12:41 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
I think clean air and water is worth investing in, I'm not 100% certain if pollution is the cause of increased temperatures and extreme weather patterns.
Kurt Dorr
1:09 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Freeman Dyson doesn't believe in Global Warming and neither do I.
jimspice
8:33 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
"One of the main causes of warming is the increase of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere resulting from our burning of fossil fuels such as oil and coal and natural gas." ~Freeman Dyson (http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/dysonf07/dysonf07_index.html)
Mike Bruno
1:26 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
It is telling that a number people here cite *individuals* for the belief/disbelief in climate change, but that entirely misses the point on scientific consensus. Any one source can be right or wrong. Einstein, Bohr, Hawking, Teller, Galileo et. al. were all wrong on many things at one time or another. (Some even have the integrity to change their minds). Citing one study or citing one scientist is a recipe for being frequently wrong. It's a math thing.
Kurt Dorr
1:32 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
@Mike, the "consensus" was wrong about Acid Rain in the 1980's. The 1990 NAPAP study and big 60 Minutes show in 1992 proved there was no Acid Rain problem in the NE U.S. They were wrong about Global cooling in the 1970's, Paul Ehrlich and the left were horribly wrong in the 1960's when the "consensus" was we had too many people on the Earth and we were all going to starve in the 1970's, and on and on. Sorry, just don't buy the Global Warming story. The "consensus" has been wrong so often that I am unwilling to spend Trillions of dollars on a problem that might not exist. Just seems stupid and silly to me to do so.
Mike Bruno
1:42 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
@Kurt
It would be too time consuming (and I wouldn't be the best authority) to describe how science can make *more* accurate predictions on long-term trends than short-term trends. (It's easier to predict weather for next year than next week). You cite comparatively transient events.
If you can just casually sweep away scientific consensus, how do you know what is true?
Paul
6:50 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Generally, TV shows dont prove anything in science. Paul Erlich was never head of a consensus - he was considered pretty wacky in scientific circles back then too.
You need to understand consensus. It generally means people agree the data is valid and real, and this consensus is one that no one takes lightly - its taken forty years to build it among scientists.
And yeah.. I'm a scientitst (not in climate though - but I know when to listen to experts)
Kurt Dorr
1:44 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
@Mike, facts swept away "consensus". As was the case with Paul Ehrlich and his faction and the Acid Rain crowd.
Mike Bruno
1:59 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
I get it Kurt. Scientists can be wrong. I agree (though my cursory research shows that acid rain was a problem and lake acidification was dramatically reduced through regulation of sulpher-dioxide effluents in both the U.S. and Europe.)
On matters of science of which one is *not* an authority, how do you know what is true? Why do you believe that the the earth orbits the sun? There is no clue visible to the lay person. How old do you think the earth is? How old do you think the universe is? Can I assume you would accept the scientific consensus on these matters?
Kurt Dorr
2:09 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Actually, the 1990 NAPAP study proved beyond a shadow of doubt there was nothing to the Acid Rain scare in the 1980's. 60 Minutes (not known for being a conservative show) exploded the whole myth in a great segment in 1992. Unfortunately the Acid Rain myth lives on, just like many other Federal programs that receive funding. Yes, I believe the Earth is as old as scientist say, yes I believe the Earth orbits the sun, etc. We need way more study of the Earth's climate before we commit Trillions of dollars to a problem that may not exist. It would be pure folly and we'd be committing economic suicide to do so.
Mike Bruno
2:16 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
OK Kurt. What percentage of scientists supporting climate change would be compelling for you? 98%? 99%? 99.44%? 100%? What's your bogie?
Mike Bruno
2:24 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
...and for the record, I think it is an open question as to whether it is even realistic to think we could make a difference in climate change even if everyone recognized it as fact.
Paul
6:38 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
While I have no doubt you saw a program on Acid Rain on 60 minutes in 1992, I can assure you that acid rain is a real problem and certainly was a real issue back in the 80s, before Sulfur Dioxides and Nitic Oxides were scrubbed from coal plants. The drastic decrease in these pollutants has significantly mitigated the problem.
Read the report yourself. ..http://www.esrl.noaa.gov/csd/aqrs/reports/napapreport05.pdf
The study of climate is pretty thorough. Maybe if 60 minutes does a program now, you'll belive in it? Because virtually ALL scientists who understand the issues do.
Independence666
2:19 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Let's just tell it like it is. This whole man made "global warming" thing is nothing more than another government attempt to create a fat new revenue stream. A carbon tax would generate huge amounts of cash for governments and, whatever was not stolen by the politicians would, among other wasteful things, be used to fund more global warming studies, thereby lining the pockets of those who promote the "consensus". The old adage, "follow the money" really applies here.
Mike Bruno
2:32 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
While I don't share your paranoia Independence666, I think "follow the money" is often good advice. Does it give you pause that the unbelievably wealthy fossil fuel interests are the ones throwing gobs of money denying climate change while thousands of scientists around the world pulling in their five-figure salaries are the ones saying it is real?
Independence666
8:40 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Mike, those five figure scientists are likely scared to death that esposing an alternative opinion could get them ostrisized and end their career. They all know that going along with the conventional wisdom will keep them employed. There's not a whole lot of courage up there in the ivory tower.
Kurt Dorr
2:29 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
I have no bogey Mike. Just feel we need more research before we spend Trillions of dollars on a problem that may not exist. Especially if you don't think we can even make a difference in climate change.
Mike Bruno
2:42 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Ok Kurt. How many studies do you need? What is *that* bogie? There have been thousands of peer-reviewed studies. Continual denial doesn't help anything.
The *acceptance* of climate change is wholly separate from the discussion of what (if anything) we do about it.
Billy Gallagher
3:22 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Science is not based upon "Consensus", Sir. If a consensus of 'scientists' tell us that the sky is green, does that make it true? In science, there is only fact. In religion, there is consensus because the beliefs are not provable beyond a reasonable doubt. The Church of Climate Change, which of course recently changed it name from the Church of Global Warming a few years back (remember when those slew of MLB games got SNOWED OUT recently?) will call any non-believers "Climate Deniers" (like Holocaust Deniers), or followers of the "swine-like" Rush Limbaugh. The more you guys squeal and blame man kind for something that man has no control over is quite telling. How long has man been around with the ability to impact the earth (if that is possible)...maybe since the Industrial Revolution? Will you eat fish from the nuclear bombed areas of Japan? Of course you will...nature has an amazing power of self-regulation and to think that man can impact it in the way you hope is simple arrogance.
Mike Bruno
3:55 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Ha! Really?!? There is consensus in religion?!?! So there is no difference between Jainism, Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Wicca?!?!?! Heck, even amongst Christian sects the variations are too numerous to mention http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christian_denominations. (I presume, though, that you have landed on the one 'true' one though.)
It so happens that the consensus on the color of the sky *is* that it is blue. In science there is only *theory*. Facts are pretty much limited to mathematics. This space and my schedule simply don't allow me to deconstruct all the wrong things you said here.
Billy Gallagher
5:29 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
For a scientist, Mike, you really are exposing your self in a bad way. You totally missed my point in that there is not ONE religion in the world, therefore only a consensus within each group of believers in a particular 'kind' of religion. There is no 'fact' that proves one religion is 'better' or more accurate than another. Same when it comes to global warming/climate change/whatever term you science deniers are using these days. Your policies are policies of economic self destruction and when we had $$ to waste on this kind of wild goose chase, well, that was one thing, but Mr. Obama has tripled our national debt in 3 or 4 years and frankly, we don't have the cash, man.
Paul
6:39 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
True. Science is based on data and provable hypotheses.
The data and proof are pretty clear... THATS why there is a consensus, silly.
Kurt Dorr
4:56 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Mike, if you understand fluid dynamics and the complexities therein you will know that even the largest super computer in the world cannot accurately model weather very effectively. There are way too many data points to do so. Even the largest supercomputer in the world struggles to model wind flow over an airplane wing effectively. The fact that world temps. have not really increased at all in the last 10 years indicates to me we should move very cautiously on this issue before we destroy our economy.
Kurt Dorr
5:00 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
No Need to Panic About Global Warming
Editor's Note: The following has been signed by the 16 scientists listed at the end of the article:
A candidate for public office in any contemporary democracy may have to consider what, if anything, to do about "global warming." Candidates should understand that the oft-repeated claim that nearly all scientists demand that something dramatic be done to stop global warming is not true. In fact, a large and growing number of distinguished scientists and engineers do not agree that drastic actions on global warming are needed.
In September, Nobel Prize-winning physicist Ivar Giaever, a supporter of President Obama in the last election, publicly resigned from the American Physical Society (APS) with a letter that begins: "I did not renew [my membership] because I cannot live with the [APS policy] statement: 'The evidence is incontrovertible: Global warming is occurring. If no mitigating actions are taken, significant disruptions in the Earth's physical and ecological systems, social systems, security and human health are likely to occur. We must reduce emissions of greenhouse gases beginning now.' In the APS it is OK to discuss whether the mass of the proton changes over time and how a multi-universe behaves, but the evidence of global warming is incontrovertible?"
Kurt Dorr
5:02 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
In spite of a multidecade international campaign to enforce the message that increasing amounts of the "pollutant" carbon dioxide will destroy civilization, large numbers of scientists, many very prominent, share the opinions of Dr. Giaever. And the number of scientific "heretics" is growing with each passing year. The reason is a collection of stubborn scientific facts.
Perhaps the most inconvenient fact is the lack of global warming for well over 10 years now. This is known to the warming establishment, as one can see from the 2009 "Climategate" email of climate scientist Kevin Trenberth: "The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't." But the warming is only missing if one believes computer models where so-called feedbacks involving water vapor and clouds greatly amplify the small effect of CO2.
The lack of warming for more than a decade—indeed, the smaller-than-predicted warming over the 22 years since the U.N.'s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) began issuing projections—suggests that computer models have greatly exaggerated how much warming additional CO2 can cause. Faced with this embarrassment, those promoting alarm have shifted their drumbeat from warming to weather extremes, to enable anything unusual that happens in our chaotic climate to be ascribed to CO2.
Paul
6:42 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Is the large numbers of prominent scientists you claim to cite that deny global warming evidence that consensus matters? 'cause I've got ten scientists to every one of yours...
Kurt Dorr
5:02 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
The fact is that CO2 is not a pollutant. CO2 is a colorless and odorless gas, exhaled at high concentrations by each of us, and a key component of the biosphere's life cycle. Plants do so much better with more CO2 that greenhouse operators often increase the CO2 concentrations by factors of three or four to get better growth. This is no surprise since plants and animals evolved when CO2 concentrations were about 10 times larger than they are today. Better plant varieties, chemical fertilizers and agricultural management contributed to the great increase in agricultural yields of the past century, but part of the increase almost certainly came from additional CO2 in the atmosphere.
Although the number of publicly dissenting scientists is growing, many young scientists furtively say that while they also have serious doubts about the global-warming message, they are afraid to speak up for fear of not being promoted—or worse. They have good reason to worry. In 2003, Dr. Chris de Freitas, the editor of the journal Climate Research, dared to publish a peer-reviewed article with the politically incorrect (but factually correct) conclusion that the recent warming is not unusual in the context of climate changes over the past thousand years. The international warming establishment quickly mounted a determined campaign to have Dr. de Freitas removed from his editorial job and fired from his university position. Fortunately, Dr. de Freitas was able to keep his university job.
Kurt Dorr
5:02 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
This is not the way science is supposed to work, but we have seen it before—for example, in the frightening period when Trofim Lysenko hijacked biology in the Soviet Union. Soviet biologists who revealed that they believed in genes, which Lysenko maintained were a bourgeois fiction, were fired from their jobs. Many were sent to the gulag and some were condemned to death.
Why is there so much passion about global warming, and why has the issue become so vexing that the American Physical Society, from which Dr. Giaever resigned a few months ago, refused the seemingly reasonable request by many of its members to remove the word "incontrovertible" from its description of a scientific issue? There are several reasons, but a good place to start is the old question "cui bono?" Or the modern update, "Follow the money."
Alarmism over climate is of great benefit to many, providing government funding for academic research and a reason for government bureaucracies to grow. Alarmism also offers an excuse for governments to raise taxes, taxpayer-funded subsidies for businesses that understand how to work the political system, and a lure for big donations to charitable foundations promising to save the planet. Lysenko and his team lived very well, and they fiercely defended their dogma and the privileges it brought them.
Kurt Dorr
5:03 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Speaking for many scientists and engineers who have looked carefully and independently at the science of climate, we have a message to any candidate for public office: There is no compelling scientific argument for drastic action to "decarbonize" the world's economy. Even if one accepts the inflated climate forecasts of the IPCC, aggressive greenhouse-gas control policies are not justified economically.
A recent study of a wide variety of policy options by Yale economist William Nordhaus showed that nearly the highest benefit-to-cost ratio is achieved for a policy that allows 50 more years of economic growth unimpeded by greenhouse gas controls. This would be especially beneficial to the less-developed parts of the world that would like to share some of the same advantages of material well-being, health and life expectancy that the fully developed parts of the world enjoy now. Many other policy responses would have a negative return on investment. And it is likely that more CO2 and the modest warming that may come with it will be an overall benefit to the planet.
Kurt Dorr
5:03 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
If elected officials feel compelled to "do something" about climate, we recommend supporting the excellent scientists who are increasing our understanding of climate with well-designed instruments on satellites, in the oceans and on land, and in the analysis of observational data. The better we understand climate, the better we can cope with its ever-changing nature, which has complicated human life throughout history. However, much of the huge private and government investment in climate is badly in need of critical review.
Every candidate should support rational measures to protect and improve our environment, but it makes no sense at all to back expensive programs that divert resources from real needs and are based on alarming but untenable claims of "incontrovertible" evidence.
Kurt Dorr
5:04 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Claude Allegre, former director of the Institute for the Study of the Earth, University of Paris; J. Scott Armstrong, cofounder of the Journal of Forecasting and the International Journal of Forecasting; Jan Breslow, head of the Laboratory of Biochemical Genetics and Metabolism, Rockefeller University; Roger Cohen, fellow, American Physical Society; Edward David, member, National Academy of Engineering and National Academy of Sciences; William Happer, professor of physics, Princeton; Michael Kelly, professor of technology, University of Cambridge, U.K.; William Kininmonth, former head of climate research at the Australian Bureau of Meteorology; Richard Lindzen, professor of atmospheric sciences, MIT; James McGrath, professor of chemistry, Virginia Technical University; Rodney Nichols, former president and CEO of the New York Academy of Sciences; Burt Rutan, aerospace engineer, designer of Voyager and SpaceShipOne; Harrison H. Schmitt, Apollo 17 astronaut and former U.S. senator; Nir Shaviv, professor of astrophysics, Hebrew University, Jerusalem; Henk Tennekes, former director, Royal Dutch Meteorological Service; Antonio Zichichi, president of the World Federation of Scientists, Geneva.
Kurt Dorr
5:04 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
I had to break the article above up into smaller bites in order to post it.
Lois Lane
5:44 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Whew Kurt, thanks for clearing that up, for a moment I thought you might have amazing words per minute typing skills!
Doremus Jessup
5:53 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
The "Australasian Climate Research Institute" is listed on the Australian Business Register as a trading name of William Kininmonth - a known Australian climate change skeptic. [2]
It is based at his private residence in Kew, Australia. It has no website, phone number or existence separate from Kininmonth. Kininmonth contributed to the IPCC's Assessment Report 4 on both Working Groups 1 and 2, his credential on the listing for WG II are as a representative of 'Australasian Climate Research'[1]
Doremus Jessup
5:57 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Claude Allegre...Asbestos
In 1996, Allègre opposed the removal of carcinogenic asbestos from the Jussieu university campus in Paris, describing it as harmless and dismissing concerns about it as a form of "psychosis created by leftists".[6] The campus' asbestos is deemed[by whom?] to have killed 22 people and caused serious health problems in 130 others.[7]
[edit] Gravity
In 1999, the Canard enchaîné, and subsequently several other media, published Allègre's claim, initially stated during a radio interview, that, if one drops a pétanque ball and a tennis ball at the same time from a tower, they will reach the ground at the same time. Allègre claimed that there was a popular misconception to the contrary, and that schoolchildren should be made to understand that two objects always fall at the same speed. The Canard responded that this was true only in a vacuum, and not in all cases as Allègre had said. The latter responded in turn, maintaining his initial statement. Georges Charpak, Nobel prize for Physics, intervened to explain that Allègre was wrong; the latter maintained his statement yet again.[6][8]
Doremus Jessup
6:02 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
"Jan Breslow, head of the Laboratory of Biochemical Genetics and Metabolism, Rockefeller University." Doesn't sound like a climate scientist to me.
Doremus Jessup
6:03 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
"Burt Rutan, aerospace engineer, designer of Voyager and SpaceShipOne" again not a climate scientist.
Doremus Jessup
6:04 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
James McGrath, professor of chemistry, Virginia Technical University, hmm not a climate scientist. Starting to see a pattern here.
Doremus Jessup
6:11 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Henk Tennekes...This guy quotes the bible to support his scientific positions...In an interview in the Dutch paper De Telegraaf, Tennekes says he was ousted from his position at the Royal Dutch Meteorological Institute due to his skepticism over climate change. After publishing a column critical of climate model accuracy, Tennekes says he was told "within two years, you'll be out on the street".[6]
According to Gerbrand Komen, a retired KNMI researcher, Tennekes' view on climate change played a minor role. More important were[7] Tennekes' personality and his solitary views on a range of subjects. As an example Komen recalls how Tennekes objected to the increase of computing power for medium-range weather forecasting, because he considered this unnecessary. According to Komen, Tennekes supported this decision by referring to biblical texts.
Paul
6:46 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
The real point to look at is published research. And over the last fifteen years, you know how many articles were published in major peer reviewed journals that rejected or significantly challenged the hypothesis of anthropogenic global warming?
I can tell you that the answer is none. Not one. Thats about as much consensus as evolutionary theory.
Billy Gallagher
7:11 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
For those of you who insist on a man made ("anthropogenic" for those of you hanging out in faculty lounges musing on how evil the Western world is)...please lead by example and give up: Flying, driving, taking the train, riding a motorcycles, using a machine to cut your lawn, clear your snow, blow dry your hair (yea right), etc etc etc. We have done more to clean up the world and help mother nature in the past 25 years than ever. Why won't China and India sign on to the silly protocols that would curb their growth? Exactly. Why should we give up what we don't have. Again, I'll point to the lack of funding to chase this dream. I know that you would say that gas should be $9/gallon like Europe in order to discourage driving, but c'mon....the little guy has had to pay and pay to fund silly programs like this and frankly, we've had enough lecturing.
Paul
8:04 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Yes, lectures are really complicated. Sorry for throwing that word, anthropogenic, in there. Those multisyllabic specific words really identify someone who doesnt know what they are talking about. Lets just make things simple and do whatever we want to do. Thats worked so well in the past.
If you take time and brainpower to understand the issue, you'll realize that we cant afford not to do anything. In fact, we are already preparing for bad things - just ask the Armed Forces, who are factoring in global warming to their long term planning. Or cities all over the world, including Chicago, who are planning on planting less hardy tree species so in fifty to 100 years we will still have trees in the streets that can handle a warmer climate.
Tell us... whats the view like with your head buried that far into the sand??
Billy Gallagher
9:57 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Less hardy trees handle a warmer climate better than hardy trees? What??
Please post some links for us chumbolones who wish to bone up on the military planning you refer to...and also, please, the City of Chicago's plans to plant other types of trees. Hey, I think the City should plan on how the won't have 50 shootings in one weekend again this year, but that's just me...i know, Paul, I know, you will say that if global warming would just go ahead and wipe us all out, we won't have to worry about 6 year old kids getting shot to death on their front porch. Let's put more of the tax dollars that we don't have into fighting the phantom of climate change vs. real life! Wow.
Paul
8:17 am on Tuesday, March 20, 2012
Are you unaware of teh Google? Or do you just like to get spoon fed?
The militarys plans are common enough - I dont need to point them out... you can find them with simple searches.
Chicago is also a simple search..
http://www.popsci.com/environment/article/2011-05/preparing-climate-change-chicago-adapting-itself-warmer-weather
Ben
11:22 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
I'm a little stunned at the uneducated comments here denying what scientists have known clearly for a while--and these comments are coming a metropolitan area. Maybe people just haven't looked at the science lately. A good summary is here: http://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/
Billy Gallagher
11:56 pm on Monday, March 19, 2012
Ben, it's OK, your elitist 'metropolitan area' views are safe. I live in flyover country in rural Wisconsin. I've seen the reports that pig and cow flatulence are a threat to our climate. I think I am all for banning those gases and we should start right here and now.
Billy Gallagher
10:08 am on Tuesday, March 20, 2012
OK Paul, now we know enough about you to simply stop the back and forth. You get your news and facts from Popular Science. We all remember seeing those whacy headlines at the news stands. But for those out there who may have forgotten, here are a sampling of not only headlines from Paul's favorite news source, but these are also ALL from the author of the article that Paul cites as cementing his belief that man, especially the USA, is to blame for todays and tomorrow's problems that may impact the world. Check these out:
-A Smartphone That Detects Whether Its User Is Depressed
-UK Report Suggests Soldiers Could One Day Plug Their Weapons Right Into Their Brains
-Paint Your Roof With Working Solar Cells Made from Grass Clippings
-A Massive Solar Eruption, the Strongest in 7 Years, Has Earth Bracing for a Radiation Storm ((-Ed note: This was last week, and all is still well here on Earth))
-Russian Space Authorities Determine Cause of Failed Mars Probe: America (of course!!!)
-Video: Groombot Brushes Cat, Ushering in a New Era of Remote Robo-Petting
-A Train to Space: All Aboard the 20,000-Mile-Per-Hour Low-Earth-Orbit Express
And, Finally, a headline that makes sense:
Canada Pulls Out of Kyoto Protocol, Making it the First Country to Legally Opt Out
Paul
3:26 pm on Tuesday, March 20, 2012
Sorry, I got the first link that I saw. You'll note the main story was from the New York Times.
I dont understand how my point... that Chicago has a long term plan to deal with climate change... is missed. I guess when you dont have any original thoughts, you have to attack the source.
See, on Google. if you want to look things up, you get a list of results. Many of them will link back to a similar source. You seem a bit unfamiliar with it, so I thought I'd let you know.
Jim Pokin
11:21 am on Tuesday, March 20, 2012
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/indicators/